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Sunday's Bible Thread #2 חכםמִקרָאִי (DH) 11/20/2022 (Sun) 02:22:50 ID:24c914 No. 2278 [Reply]
JOSHUA 6 יהושע 6 . וַיְהִ֣י ׀ בַּיֹּ֣ום הַשְּׁבִיעִ֗י וַיַּשְׁכִּ֙מוּ֙ כַּעֲלֹ֣ות הַשַּׁ֔חַר וַיָּסֹ֧בּוּ אֶת־הָעִ֛יר כַּמִּשְׁפָּ֥ט הַזֶּ֖ה שֶׁ֣בַע פְּעָמִ֑ים רַ֚ק בַּיֹּ֣ום הַה֔וּא סָבְב֥וּ אֶת־הָעִ֖יר שֶׁ֥בַע פְּעָמִֽים׃ Then on the seventh day they rose early at the dawning of the day and marched around the city in the same manner seven times; only on that day they marched around the city seven times. . וַיְהִי֙ בַּפַּ֣עַם הַשְּׁבִיעִ֔ית תָּקְע֥וּ הַכֹּהֲנִ֖ים בַּשֹּׁופָרֹ֑ות וַיֹּ֨אמֶר יְהֹושֻׁ֤עַ אֶל־הָעָם֙ הָרִ֔יעוּ כִּֽי־נָתַ֧ן יְהוָ֛ה לָכֶ֖ם אֶת־הָעִֽיר׃ At the seventh time, when the priests blew the trumpets, Joshua said to the people, "Shout! For the LORD has given you the city. . וְהָיְתָ֨ה הָעִ֥יר חֵ֛רֶם הִ֥יא וְכָל־אֲשֶׁר־בָּ֖הּ לַֽיהוָ֑ה רַק֩ רָחָ֨ב הַזֹּונָ֜ה תִּֽחְיֶ֗ה הִ֚יא וְכָל־אֲשֶׁ֣ר אִתָּ֣הּ בַּבַּ֔יִת כִּ֣י הֶחְבְּאַ֔תָה אֶת־הַמַּלְאָכִ֖ים אֲשֶׁ֥ר שָׁלָֽחְנוּ׃ "The city shall be under the ban, it and all that is in it belongs to the LORD; only Rahab the harlot and all who are with her in the house shall live, because she hid the messengers whom we sent. . וְרַק־אַתֶּם֙ שִׁמְר֣וּ מִן־הַחֵ֔רֶם פֶּֽן־תַּחֲרִ֖ימוּ וּלְקַחְתֶּ֣ם מִן־הַחֵ֑רֶם וְשַׂמְתֶּ֞ם אֶת־מַחֲנֵ֤ה יִשְׂרָאֵל֙ לְחֵ֔רֶם וַעֲכַרְתֶּ֖ם אֹותֹֽו׃ "But as for you, only keep yourselves from the things under the ban, so that you do not covet them and take some of the things under the ban, and make the camp of Israel accursed and bring trouble on it. . וְכֹ֣ל ׀ כֶּ֣סֶף וְזָהָ֗ב וּכְלֵ֤י נְחֹ֙שֶׁת֙ וּבַרְזֶ֔ל קֹ֥דֶשׁ ה֖וּא לַֽיהוָ֑ה אֹוצַ֥ר יְהוָ֖ה יָבֹֽוא׃

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If arabic is to be studied to read quran authentically and sanskrit to read hindu scriptures, which language is the best for reading the original bible? Hebrew? Aramaic? Greek? Something else?
>>2285 For Old testament, Hebrew. For Gospels and New Testament, Koine Greek or Aramaic Peshitta.

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Daily वे॑द Quote #44: 2022 November 23 द॑स्यवेवृ॑क 11/23/2022 (Wed) 03:17:17 ID:80083b No. 2284 [Reply]
प्रजा॑पतिर् • ज॑यानि॑न्द्राय वृ॑ष्णे। प्रा॑यच्छदुग्रः॑ • पृतना॑जियेषु। त॑स्मै वि॑शः • स॑मनमन्त स॑र्वाः। स॑ उग्रः॑ स॑ हि॑ • ह॑वियो बभू॑व॥ —तैत्तिरीयसं॑हिता 3.4.4.1.2 . (This is the metrically restored version. The सं॑हिता has two deficient syllables with पृतना॑ज्येषु and ह॑व्यो. मैत्रायणसं॑हिता 1.4.14.31 is similar to the first two lines but in prose: प्रजा॑पतिः प्रा॑यच्छज्ज॑यानि॑न्द्राय वृ॑ष्ण उग्रः॑ पृ॑तनासु जिष्णुः॑। And the second half is similar to मैत्रायणसं॑हिता 2.10.2.14: त॑स्मै वि॑शः • स॑मनमन्त दै॑वीः। अय॑मुग्रो॑ • विहवि॑यो य॑था॑सत्॥) . Translation: "प्रजा॑पति granted victories to bullish इ॑न्द्र, (so that He would become) fearsome in the rush of battles. To Him all the people bowed down, for He became fearsome, worthy of oblation." . Word-by-word: प्रजा॑पतिस् < प्रजा॑पति, ज॑यान् < ज॑य "victory", इ॑न्द्राय < इ॑न्द्र, वृ॑ष्णे < वृ॑षन् "bullish", प्र॑ अयच्छत् < प्र॑ यम् "grant", उग्र॑स् < उग्र॑ "fearsome", पृतना < पृ॑तना "battle", अ॑जियेषु < अ॑ज्य "rush", त॑स्मै < स॑ "He", वि॑शस् < वि॑श् "people", स॑म् अनमन्त < स॑म् नम् "bow down", स॑र्वास् < स॑र्व "all", स॑स् < स॑ "He", उग्र॑स् < उग्र॑ "fearsome", स॑स् < स॑ "He", हि॑ "because", ह॑वियस् > ह॑व्य "worthy of oblation", बभू॑व < भू "become". . छ॑न्दस्/Meter: त्रिष्टु॑भ् . Context: This प्रपाठक/chapter of the तैत्तिरीयसं॑हिता describes the "occasional offerings" separate from regularly scheduled rituals like the अग्निहोत्र॑ or दर्शपूर्णमास॑, with this section describing an offering called the ज॑य ("victory"), meant to be performed by someone engaged in a conflict. According to आपस्तम्बश्रौतसू॑त्र 5.24.3, this verse is to be recited with the thirteenth ज॑य oblation. . Interpretation: This verse came up in a recent discussion I had on the "supremacy" of certain Gods in the Vedic religion. Certainly some Gods are more powerful or "important" than others (and certainly वि॑ष्णु and रुद्र॑, though far from minor, are not the most powerful the way They are in later Hinduism). But while इ॑न्द्र is the most important God of the Vedic pantheon and the one king (एकरा॑ज्) of all the Gods, the concept of a single "supreme" God is not really coherent with Vedic metaphysics.

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was the original "mecca" actually the city of petra? Anon 11/21/2022 (Mon) 16:19:04 ID:93bd4a No. 2281 [Reply]
Gibson’s Quranic Geographies makes a powerful case for Petra from archaeology history, and literature--one worth taking on, point by point: Tradition asserts that the Quran was compiled not long after Muhammad’s death, during the caliphate of Uthman. But the earliest Quranic manuscripts date from the ninth century, two hundred years after Muhammad. This long gap in the written record raises questions about the accuracy of the information transmitted across those generations, especially where we find inconsistent, contradictory, or implausible details. For example: While tradition venerates Mecca as the Prophet's birthplace and the site of the Kaaba, the Quran cites Mecca by name only once. Could this be a later interpolation? How is Muhammad's home city described in the Quran? We read that Muhammad dwells in a rich walled city, a trade hub and ancient pre-Islamic pilgrimage site. Fertile soil and regular rain support trees and agriculture. Caves in the nearby mountains face toward the city. And tradition holds that the city lay a day's ride from Jerusalem--where Muhammad ascended to heaven. Petra fits this description much more closely than Mecca. In Muhammad’s time, Petra was a walled city, the Arab world’s premier pilgrimage site, and one of its three main trading centers. Petra’s ruins contain temples to the very pre-Islamic deities described in the Quran. Seventh century Petra lay in a fertile valley that received regular rainfall and supported agriculture. The cliffs around Petra contain numerous caves facing down into the city--like the one in which Muhammad heard the angel's command to “Recite!” Like the city described in the Quran (but unlike today’s Mecca), Petra is a day's ride from Jerusalem. By contrast, there is no record of Mecca before the ninth century--two hundred years after Muhammad. And while Petra and Medina appear on ancient trading maps, Mecca does not. Petra and Medina a contain substantial archaeological material dating to Muhammad’s time and earlier. But Mecca does not. Mecca stands in a much more arid corner of the Arabian peninsula. Paleobotanists find no evidence of trees or agriculture in the vicinity of Mecca. Mecca is of course many days away from Jerusalem by horse or camel. In short, this desert outpost doesn't really match the Quranic description of the Prophet's home--more than that, it's not clear that any substantial city existed in this location during his lifetime. But perhaps Gibson’s most intriguing line of evidence comes from the orientation of qiblas in early mosques, which he argues were built pointing worshipers’ devotions toward Petra, not Mecca. Comparing the orientations of every known mosque built during Islam's first century, he finds that these structures consistently orient worshipers not toward Mecca, nor toward Jerusalem (see next paragraph), but toward Petra. All lines drawn from these early qibla walls seem to converge on Petra. A key Quranic passage changes Islam's original direction of prayer from a unnamed holy place to a “Masjid al Haram.” Tradition holds that the original direction of prayer was toward Jerusalem, holy city of Jews and Christians. However, the site is not specified. And the earliest extant Qurans--from the ninth century--do not even contain this verse, suggesting that it is a later addition. So Gibson questions the identification of Jerusalem as the original direction of prayer: Petra had been sacred to the Arabs for centuries. The valley walls are covered with the graffiti of Arab pilgrims to pre-Islamic shrines. If Petra was indeed where Muhammad received his mission, its sacred character would have then transcended these roots. Jerusalem, he argues, only later took on special significance to Arabs. These lines of evidence point instead toward Petra as the unnamed original direction of prayer.

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>>2281 >Fertile soil and regular rain support trees and agriculture The quran never says that about mecca Let's see what the quran actually says about mecca : Our Lord! I have made some of my offspring settle in a barren valley near Your Sacred House! Our Lord! I did so that they may establish Prayer. Quran 14:37 So yeah the quran says mecca is barren not fertile, fitting description.

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Daily वे॑द Quote #43: 2022 November 22 द॑स्यवेवृ॑क 11/22/2022 (Tue) 01:20:33 ID:029e7a No. 2282 [Reply]
अग्निः॑ प्रा॑श्नातु प्रथमः॑। स॑ हि॑ वे॑द य॑था हविः॑। अ॑रिष्टमस्मा॑कं कृण्व॑न्। ब्राह्मणो॑ ब्राह्मणे॑भियः॥ —आपस्तम्बमन्त्रप्रश्न॑ 2.10.7 . (This is the metrically restored version. The सं॑हिता has a deficient syllable with ब्राह्मणे॑भ्यः. The first two lines are also तैत्तिरीयब्रा॑ह्मण 2.4.8.7.3–4 and काठसं॑हिता 13.15.10, but the latter are unique to this text.) . Translation: "Let अग्नि॑ consume the oblation first—because He knows thus—making us safe from injury, the ब्राह्मण॑ for ब्राह्मण॑s." . Word-by-word: अग्नि॑स् < अग्नि॑, प्र॑ अश्नातु < प्र॑ अश् "consume", प्रथम॑स् < प्रथम॑ "first", स॑स् < स॑ "He", हि॑ "because", वे॑द < विद् "know", य॑था "thus", हवि॑स् "oblation", अ॑- "not", रिष्टम् < रिष्ट॑ < रिष् "injury", अस्मा॑कम् < वय॑म् "we", कृण्व॑न् < कृ "make", ब्राह्मण॑स् < ब्राह्मण॑, ब्राह्मणे॑भियस् < ब्राह्मण॑. . Meter: अनुष्टु॑भ् . Context: According to आपस्तम्बगृह्यसू॑त्र 5.13.16, this verse is to be recited by a host while sacrificing the belly of a cow into the fire in honor of a guest. Contrary to modern Hindu nationalist narratives, bulls and cows were certainly killed and eaten in Vedic times; but contrary to liberal narratives, they were only killed in special circumstances rather than regularly like other animals, and otherwise were called अ॑घ्न्य "not to kill". According to आपस्तम्ब, for example: एतावद्गोरालम्भनमतिथिः पितरो विवाहश्च। "Thus (the occasions for) the sacrifice of a cow are a guest, the Fathers, and a marriage."

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Anon 11/19/2022 (Sat) 04:06:45 ID:7752dc No. 2275 [Reply]
I’m an atheist.
>>2275 >no doubt by accident what a gargantuan cope. kek.

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Daily वे॑द Quote #42: 2022 November 21 द॑स्यवेवृ॑क 11/20/2022 (Sun) 06:07:01 ID:d1b94a No. 2279 [Reply]
स॑ जातू॑भर्मा • श्रद्द॑धान ओ॑जः। पु॑रो विभिन्द॑न्न् • अचरद्वि॑ दा॑सीः। विद्वा॑न्वज्रिन् • द॑स्यवे हेति॑मस्य। आ॑र्यं स॑हो • वर्धया द्युम्न॑मिन्द्र॥ —ऋग्वेद॑ 1.103.3 . Translation: "He, a supporter by nature, trusted for (his) vigor, passed through the cities of the दास॑, breaking them apart. (O) knower, O thunder-bearer, cast Your missile at the द॑स्यु! Increase the strength and splendor of the आ॑र्य, O इ॑न्द्र." . Word-by-word: स॑स् < स॑ "He", जातू॑ "nature", भर्मा < भ॑र्मन् "support", श्रथ् < श्र॑थ् "faith", द॑धानस् < द॑धान < धा "put", ओ॑जस् "vigor", पु॑रस् < पु॑र् "city", विभिन्द॑न् < वि॑ भिद् "break apart", अचरत् वि॑ < वि॑ चर् "pass through", दा॑सीस् < दा॑सी < दा॑स "of the दास॑", विद्वा॑न् < विद् "know", वज्रिन् < वज्रि॑न् < व॑ज्र "thunderbolt", द॑स्यवे < द॑स्यु, हेति॑म् < हेति॑ "missile", अस्य < अस् "cast", आ॑र्यम् < आ॑र्य, स॑हस् "strength", वर्धया < वृध् "increase", द्युम्न॑म् < द्युम्न॑ "splendor", इन्द्र < इ॑न्द्र. . Meter: त्रिष्टु॑भ् . Interpretation: Mirroring yesterday's Bible thread >>>/rta/2278 by Dravidian Hyperborean discussing the Israelite conquest of Canaanite cities by the will of YHWH, today's वे॑द verse discusses the आ॑र्य conquest of the द॑स्युs' cities by the will of इ॑न्द्र. . The term द॑स्यु, which this verse and many others make clear to be synonymous with दास॑, connotes the (human) enemy tribes of the आ॑र्यs, and assuredly not some sort of metaphors or demons as believed by people like Aurobindo. Even in post-Vedic literature we find द॑स्यु clearly being used to mean a human: . मुखबाहूरुपज्जानाम्।

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Daily वे॑द Quote #40: 2022 November 19 द॑स्यवेवृ॑क 11/18/2022 (Fri) 17:14:44 ID:76b438 No. 2271 [Reply]
तां॑ पूषञ् • छिव॑तमामे॑रयस्व। य॑स्यां बी॑जं • मनुषि॑या व॑पन्ति। या॑ न ऊरू॑ • उशती॑ वि श्र॑याते। य॑स्यां उश॑न्तः • प्र ह॑राम शे॑पम्॥ —ऋग्वेद॑ 10.85.37, आपस्तम्बमन्त्रप्रश्न॑ 1.11.6 . (This is the metrically restored version. The सं॑हिता has a deficient syllable with मनुष्या᳚. अथर्ववेद॑ 14.2.38 has श्र॑याति and ह॑रेम, as do some manuscripts of the आपस्तम्बमन्त्रप्रश्न॑.) . Translation: "O पूष॑न्, rouse that kindest (bride) here, in whom men scatter their seed, who eagerly shall spread her thighs for us, in whom we eagerly shall thrust the penis." . Word-by-word: ता॑म् < सा॑ "she", पूषन् < पूष॑न्, शिव॑ "kind", -तमाम् < -तम "most", आ॑ ईरयस्व < आ॑ ईर् "rouse here", य॑स्याम् < या॑ "who", बी॑जम् < बी॑ज "seed", मनुषि॑यास् < मनुष्य᳚ "man", व॑पन्ति < वप् "scatter", या॑ "who", नस् < वय॑म् "we", ऊरू॑ < ऊरु॑ "thigh", उशती॑ < वश् "desire", वि श्र॑याते < वि॑ श्रि "spread", य॑स्याम् < या॑ "who", उश॑न्तस् < उश॑न् < वश् "desire", प्र ह॑राम < प्र॑ हृ "thrust", शे॑पम् < शे॑प "penis". . Meter: त्रिष्टु॑भ् . Context: Continuing with the wedding-hymn from the ऋग्वेद॑, this verse is in one sense the "climax" of the hymn and of the wedding-night, describing the deflowering of the bride. Sexual intercourse between man and wife is in Hinduism a profoundly sacred and divine act, not something to be neglected or taken casually as in modern times, and is sometimes accompanied by म॑न्त्रs. According to आपस्तम्बगृह्यसू॑त्र 3.8.10, this verse is to be recited by the groom to the bride after butter has been offered into the fire and smeared on the region of their hearts, immediately before intercourse with her. . Contrary to the narrative of colonial scholars going out of their way to insert sexual material into the वे॑द, they have often done precisely the opposite. Compare Griffith's impressively euphemistic translation: "O Pusan, send her on as most auspicious, her who shall be the sharer of my pleasures; Her who shall twine her loving arms about me, and welcome all my love and mine embraces."

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Too sexy yaara.
What does vedas say about virginity of a male and a female?
>>2274 As with many moral issues, no explicit statement can be found in the Vedic Sanskrit scriptures (सं॑हिताs and ब्रा॑ह्मणs) themselves, since they're focused on ritual practice rather than moral laws. Certainly there is no mention of premarital sex, but no explicit prohibition of it either. . Some statements on virginity at marriage can be found in early post-Vedic literature, for example आपस्तम्बधर्मसू॑त्र 2.6.13.3 (associated with the कृष्णयजुर्वेद॑): पूर्ववत्यामसंस्कृतायां वर्ण अन्तरे च मैथुने दोषः। "Sexual intercourse with a previously married woman, or with an unmarried woman, or between castes, is a sin." . By the period of the धर्मशास्त्र॑s the rules against premarital sex had become much more codified, but these aren't exactly "Vedic". However, I think it's fair to assume that in a fairly rigid patriarchal society like the Vedic आ॑र्यs', it's highly likely that the virginity of a woman at marriage would be mandated and highly unlikely that women would be allowed to have premarital sex, so the rules of the धर्मशास्त्र॑s here wouldn't be far from the rules in Vedic times. And certainly there are many Vedic references to unspecified sexual immorality. . The Vedic stance on women having extramarital sex (after marriage) is much more explicit. For example, शतपथब्रा॑ह्मण 2.5.2.20: वरुण्यं᳚ वा॑ एत॑त्स्त्री॑ करोति य॑दन्य॑स्य स॑त्यन्ये॑न च॑रति। "Against व॑रुण a woman commits (a sin), when belonging to one man she has sex with another."
>>2276 Thanks for explanation yaar

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Daily वे॑द Quote #41: 2022 November 20 द॑स्यवेवृ॑क 11/19/2022 (Sat) 02:28:02 ID:1608bb No. 2272 [Reply]
दिव॑स्प॑रि • प्रथमं॑ जज्ञे अग्निः॑। अस्म॑द्द्विती॑यं • प॑रि जात॑वेदाः। तृती॑यमप्सु॑ • नृम॑णा अ॑जस्रम्। इ॑न्धान एनं • जरते सुवाधीः॑॥ —ऋग्वेद॑ 10.45.1, तैत्तिरीयसं॑हिता 4.2.2.1.1, आपस्तम्बमन्त्रप्रश्न॑ 2.11.21, शतपथब्रा॑ह्मण 6.7.4.3, many other places . (This is the metrically restored version. The सं॑हिता has a deficient syllable with स्वाधीः॑. Note that the second syllable of जज्ञे is to be scanned लघु॑/short, as if जज्ञय्.) . Translation: "From Heaven, first, अग्नि॑ was born. From us, second, (अग्नि॑ was born) as जात॑वेदस्. (Born) third in the waters, inexhaustible (अग्नि॑) is praised by the manly-minded, attentive (mortal) who kindles Him." . Word-by-word: दिव॑स् < दि॑व् "Heaven", प॑रि "from", प्रथम॑म् < प्रथम॑ "first", जज्ञे < जन् "bear", अग्नि॑स् < अग्नि॑, अस्म॑त् < वय॑म् "we", द्विती॑यम् < द्विती॑य "second", प॑रि "from", जात॑वेदास् < जात॑वेदस् = अग्नि॑, तृती॑यम् < तृती॑य "third", अप्सु॑ < अ॑प् "water", नृ < नृ॑ "man", म॑णास् < म॑नस् "mind", अ॑जस्रम् < अ॑जस्र "inexhaustible", इ॑न्धानस् < इ॑न्धान < इन्ध् "kindle", एनम् < एन "He", जरते < जॄ "praise", सु < सु॑ "good", आधी॑स् < आधी॑ "attention". . Meter: त्रिष्टु॑भ् . Context: Moving on from our previous wedding-hymn, the couple conceived and has now delivered a child. This verse is part of the famous वात्सप्र॑ hymn (named for its author वत्सप्री॑), which is to be recited by the father to the newborn baby after he places the baby on his lap and kisses him on the head, according to आपस्तम्बगृह्यसू॑त्र 6.15.1. According to शतपथब्रा॑ह्मण 6.7.4.2, performing the वात्सप्र॑ rite will give the baby a long life. . But what does the verse actually mean? It's cryptic at first glance. What is being described is the triple birth of the God अग्नि॑—many things about अग्नि॑ come in triplets, such as His three births, three homes, three natures, and three heads. First अग्नि॑ was born in the sky as lightning; then He was born from mortals on Earth in the form of जात॑वेदस्, the conduit between men and Gods; and finally He was born in the waters, hence the Indo-European epithet "descendant of the waters" (अपां॑ न॑प्तृ) for the Fire.

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Anon 11/18/2022 (Fri) 04:13:42 ID:3a89e9 No. 2267 [Reply]
How to learn sankrit
>>2267 learnsanskrit.org
>>2268 Mujhe Hindi to sankrit sikhni hai

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Daily वे॑द Quote #39: 2022 November 18 द॑स्यवेवृ॑क 11/17/2022 (Thu) 18:55:51 ID:64244f No. 2264 [Reply]
सम्रा॑ज्ञी श्व॑शुरे भव। सम्रा॑ज्ञी श्वश्रुवां॑ भव। न॑नान्द्रि सम्रा॑ज्ञी भव। सम्रा॑ज्ञी अ॑धि देवृ॑षु॥ —ऋग्वेद॑ 10.85.46 . (This is the metrically restored version. The सं॑हिता has a deficient syllable with श्वश्र्वां॑ and an extra syllable with न॑नान्दरि.) . Translation: "Be queen over your father-in-law, be queen over your mother-in-law, be queen over your sister-in-law, be queen over your brothers-in-law!" . Word-by-word: सम्रा॑ज्ञी "queen", श्व॑शुरे < श्व॑शुर "father-in-law", भव < भू "be", सम्रा॑ज्ञी "queen", श्वश्रुवा॑म् < श्वश्रू॑ "mother-in-law", भव < भू "be", न॑नान्द्रि < न॑नान्दृ "sister-in-law", सम्रा॑ज्ञी "queen", भव < भू "be", सम्रा॑ज्ञी "queen", अ॑धि "over", देवृ॑षु < देवृ॑ "brother-in-law". . Meter: अनुष्टु॑भ् . Context: Continuing with the wedding-hymn today, this verse corresponds to आपस्तम्बमन्त्रप्रश्न॑ 1.6.6, and according to आपस्तम्बगृह्यसू॑त्र 2.5.22, it is to be recited by the groom to his bride after she has mounted the chariot that will carry the couple to the boat. . In contrast to the low status of brides in much of later Indian society, where the bride was often abused and treated as a servant by her in-laws, a bride held great respect and influence over her new family in Vedic society, and was to be treated like a queen by them.

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